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September 12, 2008

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Well I think you are missing a more important cause for both gays and blacks.

Blacks in both Africa and America are more likely to have **concurrent** sexual partners.. that is multiple sexual partners at the same time, which is extremely conducive to disease transmission.

Black people and gay people do have more sexual partners, but this is the more important fact.

Straight, white people that do have a lot of sexual partners generally go through sexual partners sequentially, creating a much less amplified virulence network.

Such contortions to write a post regarding AIDS prevention without mentioning condoms!

Half Sigma favors criminalizing gay sex. Here are some of his previous postings on the topic:
http://www.halfsigma.com/2007/06/gay_sex_inheren.html
http://www.halfsigma.com/2008/01/another-post-ab.html
http://www.halfsigma.com/2008/01/the-next-aids.html

I don't think queers give a damn about the AIDS thing. I remember reading somewhere that gays on average, have an above average intelligence(I may be wrong). There was the whole Silence=Death thing, ACT Up and all the rest of that garbage. Recently, there was that "Red" campaign "If One Of Us Has AIDS We All Do" tripe and AIDS awareness, use a condom, etc... has been around forever...All the screaming, protesting, acting like idiots in church and nothing about personal responsibility. Not to mention the asinine dire predictions about a heterosexual AIDS pandemic. It is a disease of junkies, queers and negroes, the end.
Gays know and have known for years that gay bareback sex spreads AIDS, but that doesn't stop them from engaging in it. They are the most narcissistic(malignintly so, for that matter) people in the world. Mapplethorpe forbid they take responsibility for their own actions, it is always more money for AIDS research, more "awareness" and other ridiculous stuff.

Gay Geek wants gay men to get AIDS! Discouraging anal sex in favor of oral sex, and encouraging (serial) monogamy of multiple concurrent relationships would help gay men live longer, healthier lives. Granted, that might reduce the pleasure they get. It is not a choice I feel comfortable making for homosexuals. But it is a tradeoff. I don't feel super responsible for anyone else's hedonic function.

Segregating HIV positive prisoners might help blacks. But not much: as the article says, the sort of people who end up in prison engaged in high-risk behavoir outside. African countries have high HIV rates without high prison churn. Reducing prison churn with longer sentences might reduce HIV infections in blacks.

Though the implication of Half's "contortions" may be true. Ceteris paribus, a group that uses condoms more gets fewer STDs. Black people may simply be less able to use condoms reliably. Lower IQ + higher sex drive + stronger time preference -> lower condom use

lower condom use + less ability to pair bond + network effect caused by other blacks behaving the same way -> more venereal disease

Reason a) is unlikely. Blacks have higher rates of pretty much every STD. It is not very likely that they just happen to be more vulnerable to lots of different viruses and bacteria that happen to be spread through sex. Though it is possible that selection of West Africans for resistance to protozoan diseases and fewer person to person diseases of all sorts left them more vulnerable to all viral and bacterial infections.

I'm surprised you even care as long as it's just blacks and gay people.

Oops meant discouraging multiple concurrent relationships in favor of monogamy or serial monogamy.

However, we should not forget that the really dangererous homosexuals are the ones who haven't come out of the closet. Those who have a wife or girlfriends as a coverup but live a parallel life humping fags and trannies: these are the men who are spreading the disease into the healthy heterosexual community: forcing homosexuals underground therefore is probably counterproductive: homosexual men should preferably avoid sex with females.
This is another advantage of dating teen girls: there are much less likely to have aids compared to older women.

1) According to the oncologists treating one of my family members, black people tend to have weaker immune systems when compared to white people. The white blood cell counts of blacks are lower than their white counterparts. In turn, the dark skin of black people inhibits Vitamin D reception which also plays a role in immune system regulation.

2) There are black men who lead double lives as men who have sex with their girlfriend(s) and then have sex with other men, but never consider themselves to be gay.

3) High out of wedlock births also imply a certain degree of poor condom use.

4) I suspect that AIDS is also spreading via prisons. Consensual and non-consensual anal sex without condoms can spread the virus, which then grows in the greater black community when the men return from prison and have sex with others.

5) The ratio of males to females in some black communities makes it easier for black men to have multiple relationships because their male competitors are either dead or in jail.

If you're interested in the demographics of HIV, you'll get better information from the skeptics than the NYT. For example:

http://hivskeptic.wordpress.com/2008/08/27/hiv-demographics-are-predictable-hiv-is-not-a-contagious-infection/

"...homosexual men should preferably avoid sex with females."

They usually do because well, they're fags! I'm sorry, but your whole comment had me cracking up.

"2) There are black men who lead double lives as men who have sex with their girlfriend(s) and then have sex with other men, but never consider themselves to be gay."

Ah yes, the whole "down low" phenomenon.

""...homosexual men should preferably avoid sex with females."
It is not uncommon for homosexual men to have wifes and girlfriends to hide that their are homosexual and also live a secret gay life. These homosexuals are the most dangerous because they can spread the virus into the heterosexual community. So it may be counterproductive for a society to punish homosexuals and force them underground.

Something doesn't add up regarding AIDS and blacks. Other studies (I think it was even discussed here previously) state that blacks: 1.) Use condoms more than whites 2.) Black teenagers have sex while drunk/on drugs at rates less often than white teenagers.

So, why the discrepancy? If condom usage is higher, why the higher AIDS rates? Is there something else going on? Are these studies simply bogus and/or "PC propaganda"? Is there some "mystery factor" involved, such as vitamin D as alluded to by Mr. Alexander?

Blacks have higher testosterone levels and therefore are more promiscuous, rape more, have bigger penises and so on...
Obviously more frequent less constraint sexual activity coupled with drug use leads to increased aids level.

"Reason a) is unlikely. Blacks have higher rates of pretty much every STD. It is not very likely that they just happen to be more vulnerable to lots of different viruses and bacteria that happen to be spread through sex."


Nope, completely wrong. The relative isolation and low population density of Africa were a fairly strong insulator from this entire class of transmission.

Europeans really have had a much longer exposure to nearly all sexual diseases than Africans, and so have likely built up much more specialized genetic resistance.

This is probably the first or second strongest reason along with multiple concurrent partners.

Gannon:

"Blacks have higher testosterone levels and therefore are more promiscuous, rape more, have bigger penises and so on..."

Dude, could you please go back to molesting children or whatever it is you do in your spare time?

Rain And:

"This is probably the first or second strongest reason along with multiple concurrent partners."

Do you have a source for that? The article clearly says that "black men were no more likely to be drug users or to engage in risky sex than were white men".

"Dude, could you please go back to molesting children or whatever it is you do in your spare time?"

And you need to get back to "studying." This isn't some seredipitious conversation between classes and labs you know.

"Do you have a source for that? The article clearly says that "black men were no more likely to be drug users or to engage in risky sex than were white men"."

Please read more carefully, Vim. Gannon said that not me.

"Dude, could you please go back to molesting children or whatever it is you do in your spare time?"

14 and 15 year old females are young women, not children.

"14 and 15 year old females are young women, not children."

Maybe a century ago or in 3rd world countries, but not in 2008 America.

mnjohn:

"14 and 15 year old females are young women, not children."

Yes. To desperate internet pervs, I'm sure it must look that way. The logic goes something like, if even 18 year old girls are too smart to take one of these losers then maybe 14 and 15 year olds are stupid enough. And then out of necessity, comes policy. However, out in the real world, the rest of us know better.

Obviously, we let 14-15 year old girls drive, vote, fight in war, drink, smoke, work and so many of them hold significant roles in society such as congresswomen and aircraft pilots. We even let them enter into contracts, banks give them credit cards and if they commit crimes, their records are publicly available and they go to jail just like anybody else. Right?

So anyway, what's important is that we leave them all the double standards of being a child but make sure they are sexually available for middle-aged guys who can't hack it with women their own age. Them being 'women' and all.

My girlfriend is almost 18 anyway.
A child by definition can't have offspring. So biologically speaking 14 plus girls are not children. Vim, you can refute me with data if you like. But yes, I believe the average black man has a higher sex drive than the average Chinese. I read somewhere once that blacks have a higher concentration of testosterone.

Rain And:

"This is probably the first or second strongest reason along with multiple concurrent partners.

Posted by: Rain And | September 12, 2008 at 02:04 PM"

Am I going crazy here? This is what I see on my screen. Are you saying you are just unthinkingly repeating what Gannon is saying?

I will say I think Gannon is a moron. I have more esteem for the opinions of his conspefic, my dog. So I didn't think anybody would be repeating anything he had to say.

Vim, middleaged guys on average are not intrested in women their age, unless they formed a bond earlier with them. Most middleaged men are interested in women somewhere between the 22-32 age range.
Second, having sex is not comparable to agree to a contract. People who celebrate contracts with minors don't go to jail, but simply the contract can be anulled if it affects negatively the interets of the minor. Minors can enter contracts with parental or judicial authorization.
But my main point is that CIVIL LAW is completely different from criminal law. Criminal law only punishes behaviour which is very socially damaging. It is natural fro teens to have sex, and as a general rule consent given among sexualy mature people is valid. Usualy, age of consent is the same as age of criminal responsibility, that is 14 or so. People between 14-17(20) can be send to reformatory, can sign contracts with parental consent and also can have sex. Having sex is a natural act and should not be confused with the full conbtractual and political rights and duties a pewrson acquires at 18.

Vim I don't really think you understand the meaning of the term science. If you believe I'm wrong, use logic against me, but instead you insult me. It seems that you have trouble accepting empiric evidence, and prefer to shape the world accoringto your own ideals.

Blacks have kept syphilis and the other STDs alive in the US. HIV piggybacks onto other STDs that cause breaks in skin and mucus membranes. IV drug users are common in black inner cities.

Why is the black community full of STDs? It must have something to do with behavior. Maybe genetics.

Gannon, yes, everyone knows that teenagers have strong sexual urges.

But in the United States, the prevailing view is that children (and one definition of that is anyone under the age of 18) are better off not having sex. At least this was the prevailing view before the Republican National Convention.

You may now stop hijacking this thread. Please discuss AIDS.

Vim, you asked me for a source on "drug use" and "risky sex", when that quote contains nothing about "drug use" and "risky sex". The comment references only networks and genetic resistance.

So I rightly infer you were responding to Gannon's comment right above mine on drug use and risky sex: "Obviously more frequent less constraint sexual activity coupled with drug use leads to increased aids level."

If you weren't then you clearly wouldn't have asked me for a source on drug use.

(and before you bullshit me, sexual networks are a bit more complicated than "risky sex")

http://www.stdjournal.com/pt/re/std/abstract.00007435-200607001-00007.htm;jsessionid=LK1FhSnrwTYJQqtvz0JmN8dQmHLpnmDGMdZz7lJTgJjs9HKNvymT!612563345!181195628!8091!-1

Gannon: I meant to say 'conspecific' above. My apologies ;)

Here's the Washington Post about multiple concurrent partnerships in Africa.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/03/01/AR2007030101607.html


Multiple concurrent partnerships are more common among blacks in Africa, the US, the Caribbean, Latin America, Europe, and the Middle East. And blacks have higher HIV rates in all these regions.

Rain And, did you miss the next sentence? I said blacks may be more vulnerable to all viral and bacterial illnesses, not only AIDS or STDs specifically.

I find the sex ratios of HIV infection in Africa interesting. 2-3 times as many women infected as men, consistent with a small fraction of men having sex with lots of women as well as concurrency.

"Maybe a century ago or in 3rd world countries, but not in 2008 America. "

Google "quinceanera" or better still read Udolpho's definition:

"Quinceañera (defined)… A coming-of-age party thrown for a daughter of Mexican parents, marking the start of her transformation from an attractive, slim adolescent into a repulsive, crabby, morbidly obese woman. Usually arranged shortly before her first attempt to become pregnant."

Coming to a neighborhood near you, tough guy.

Sure, rob, I caught that part. But on the whole I'd say Africans have higher bacterial and viral resistance. This is why Africa was and is such a death hole for Europeans.

So yeah, it is likely they are less resistant to STDs specifically.

The big killers historically for whites in Africa are protozoan. Different beasties, different optimal immune responses. Like Aborigines who have stronger inflammatory response that screws them when they get viral and bacterial infections instead of the parasitic infections they're adapted to. Like lots of populations, blacks were thrashed by smallpox and other viruses and because they had lower resistance.

"But in the United States, the prevailing view is that children (and one definition of that is anyone under the age of 18) are better off not having sex."

I hope this isn't too off topic that it won't get posted; The idea that teenagers under 18 shouldn't have sex is precisely the reason America has the highest rate of teenage pregnancy in the developed world. So by not treating them like adults we are actually forcing them into very early adulthood by having them have children which is much worse. (Sarah Palin's daughter has seemed to draw some scrutiny on this blog...). So which would we rather have, the reality of teenage sex and low teenage pregnancy or abstinence only education via "teenage sex is bad" and an absurd teenage pregnancy rate. Also Canada just raised their age of consent to 16 from 14 and I don't see anybody calling them a third world country, or any Europeans countries with lower ages of consent for that matter. But i'll stay on topic from now on.

"we need a public information campaign telling people not to have anal sex."

I agree. Unfortunately, Mr. Spungen does not.

I'm really sick of all the pro-anal propaganda that's popped up everywhere in the past decade. Remember when oral sex was kinky?

"Most middleaged men are interested in women somewhere between the 22-32 age range."

I remember being extremely repulsed at that age by them, however.

Wow, lets see how many minority groups you can defame in one blog entry.

How about the fact that HIV STARTED in Africa and was already seeded in large populations before enough was known about it to have people start protecting themselves. It was also already seeded in the MSM community long before anyone knew how it spreads.

How about the fact that HIV always follows poverty around - in the United States and elsewhere - and that people who are less healthy when it comes to diet and nutrition have suppressed immune systems to begin with, which leads to more copies of the HIV virus in their blood and are more infectuous to sexual partners.

How about the fact that Africa has a higher proportion of young people than any other continent and young people are more sexually active than middle-aged adults. Some countries in Africa have over 80 percent of the population under the age of 40.

How about the fact that condoms were unavailable and basically unheard of in some parts of Africa until anti HIV campaigns began distributing them, because people are still living in third world conditions.

How about the fact that people living in pressing or war-torn conditions don't think about the next decade when they don't even know if they'll be alive for it, so have less of a reason to worry about HIV.

How about the fact that you can have HIV for up to 10 years without knowing that you have it, so people with HIV in Africa, who lived in third world conditions where testing was unheard of, were more likely to spread the virus to others.

"How about the fact that condoms were unavailable and basically unheard of in some parts of Africa until anti HIV campaigns began distributing them, because people are still living in third world conditions."

Blacks couldn't invent condoms themselves, they had to wait for the White Man to show up? Low average intelligence.


"How about the fact that people living in pressing or war-torn conditions don't think about the next decade when they don't even know if they'll be alive for it, so have less of a reason to worry about HIV."

No future time orientation. And with all the wars going, it shows blacks are pretty violent too. Nothing we don't already know...

Stay out of the 'hood and away from the queers, you'll be OK.

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