More Trayvon Martin thoughts

Today on Capitol Hill, black lawmakers continue to call the incident a hate crime and they demand action. The principle of innocent until proven guilty, or the wise policy of not speaking about the issue without knowing all of the facts doesn’t apply.

Now people who have been reading my blog for a while know that I occasionally become obsessed with topics and write about them for longer than some of my readers would like. But I don’t think I’m making that mistake with the Trayvon Martin incident. I think this is a major event that has a lot of implications for the future of our nation, and I’m not entirely sure how it will turn out.

I’m pretty certain in my assumption that the real facts of the case, which will come out before the jury, make it likely that a jury would find in favor of the defendant. Remember that at this time, most of facts are hidden because the police have not released to the public any details of their investigation except for the report filled out by the first on-scene responders (who are presumably patrol officers and not involved in homicide investigations). However, we do know that the case was reviewed by prosecuting attorneys and they told the police to let George Zimmerman go and not to book his arrest as an official arrest. This either means the state attorneys are racist (very unlikely) or that based on the facts they thought it very likely they would lose the case. State attorneys are like the characters in the Tom Wolfe novel Bonfire of the Vanities who relish the idea of being able to prosecute a rich white guy for the murder of a black. Yes, Zimmerman is not rich, and he’s half Hispanic, but a middle-class half-Hispanic is a good-enough stand-in for the more desirable rich white defendant.

So what looks like a strong possibility is that Zimmerman will soon be arrested (again) and charged with homicide and held in jail until his trial. Let’s hope that he doesn’t get beaten up or even killed while he’s in jail. At his trial, there’s a strong chance the jury will find him not-guilty. This verdict won’t be accepted by the blacks, who will riot, and perhaps, unlike the Rodney King riots which were local to Los Angeles, these riots will be nationwide riots and not limited to Florida.

An unanswered question is how Hispanics think about these events. With all of the news attention being paid to this story, I have yet to read a single article about the Hispanic community’s reaction to these events. If we are lucky, the Hispanics will side with Zimmerman. I say this would be good luck because it’s bad for the future of the country as well as the future of Hispanics in this country if they think of themselves as black and vote like blacks. It’s much better for Hispanics to aspire to be like Zimmerman, a guy with a wife, a house, a job, who attended college part-time, and who cared enough about his community to volunteer for a citizen’s watch.

Comments

[Fiddlesticks]

"unlike the Rodney King riots which were local to Los Angeles..."

Not true, HS...
http://www.deseretnews.com/article/224134/KING-VERDICT-FALLOUT-SPREADS.html

[amac78]

The recording of Trayvon's final cellphone call to his girlfriend has been used by the Martin family to support the idea that Zimmerman was the aggressor.

Gucci Little Piggy discussed this today in "Trayvon Martin’s conversation with his girlfriend and other stuff".
http://tinyurl.com/GLPiggy-Trayvon-call-post

See the main post, my comment of 03/28/2012 at 10:06 am, and my comment of 03/28/2012 at 1:33 pm.

I don't understand how this recording was made, or even if it was. Just a small piece of the puzzle that doesn't seem to fit.

[Peter]

My impression is that while Hispanics and blacks have similar voting patterns, if perhaps not as overwhelmingly Democratic on the Hispanic side, in most other respects there's not much cultural affinity between the groups. Hispanics tend to be less active politically and not as likely to air their grievances in public.

[MRM]

I have wondered about the Hispanic reaction as well. Considering the rise of black on brown crime as Hispanics have moved into US cities, this might be an event that nudges them or at least causes some rifts in the Dem patchwork coalition of victims. I could see it doing more damage to Dem efforts in Florida.

I see this as having more of a negative effect on the media than the media realizes. The initial framing of the story when matched to reality is so distorted and different that they lose credibility to more and more sheeple. The media gatekeepers lose power with each 10 year old photo of Trayvon they display.

[Anonymous]

I think hispanics do want to be guys like Zimmerman and I think they generally would side with him on this one, but they mostly don't know about it. Professional hispanics have been told by cultural marxist HQ to keep their mouths shut and univision probably isn't reporting on it.

Republicans had an opportunity to blow the rainbow coalition apart and they've blown it.

[Jokah Macpherson]

This supports Sailer's theory that Hispanics are not very political despite the image their putative "leaders" would otherwise have us believe.

[jeanne]

Republicans need the hispanic equivalent of Allen West to be their mouthpiece on matters like this.

Oh, wait, I guess that's Marco Rubio isn't it...oh well.

[hendrick kinsley]

I agree with you, but unfortunately your assessment of what would be "best for hispanics" can be viewed as merely a statement of what would be best for whites. Let's face it, whites need another ally in the (apparently imminent) race war with blacks. A case could well be made that at least in the short term, in terms of ladling out guvmint bennies, hispanics would do better in the Sharpton camp. Blacks are deracinated. All the hopes that old-line liberals like me had for them have been dashed. They've turned out to be nothing but a collection of big biceps.

[famously nameless]

I'm not sure if I mentioned this on past comments, but I'm Hispanic.

Some of my thoughts:

@Anonymous 3:16 - Univision has been reporting on it, but not as obsessively. And it's not treated as a race issue, because....... (see the next paragraph)

"Considering the rise of black on brown crime as Hispanics have moved into US cities..."
It's very high actually. But Hispanics tend not to complain, and I think many Blacks know this.

For me, its bittersweet: it's very bad that a death was involved, but at least its a sign that Hispanics are gradually shedding political and community apathy.

[Rivelino]

"This supports Sailer's theory that Hispanics are not very political"

excellent point, hadn't thought about that.

i am hispanic, GZ looks a lot like my cousin, and i am pissed about this story for a bunch of reasons, but one of them is definitely that i feel like, wtf, why is the hispanic man who is aspiring to be "white" -- to have white values, to get ahead in life -- why is he being crucified for saving his own life after he was attacked by a black thug.

hispanics from my observation, all they care about is family and religion, and they are *not* political. that is clear. if they were, they would be fighting for GZ. and like HS, i have not heard or read one single story about hispanics rallying around george.

pathetic.

[Conquistador]

"Republicans had an opportunity to blow the rainbow coalition apart and they've blown it." - Anonymous

Republicans are SWPL with one or two reservations about embracing leftism. It gets even worse with their spouses and children. Just look at John McCain. The GOP won't save us.

[mikeraw]

I'm Hispanic and I side with Zimmerman and I'm especially AGAINST the mainstream media's handling of this...

[Shawn]

The racist media is out of control. No real media attention for this case:

"A 13-year-old boy who police say was doused with gasoline and lit on fire last week while walking home from school is recovering from first-degree burns to his face and head.

The boy was just two blocks from his home in Kansas City Tuesday when two teenagers began to follow him and then attacked him, his mother, Melissa Coon, said.

Police have described the suspects as black 16-year-olds, while the victim is white.

'We were told it's a hate crime,' Coon told KTLA."

Source: http://articles.nydailynews.com/2012-03-04/news/31122324_1_white-boy-fire-tv-station

[Peter]

Hispanics in general have a low profile in America. Certainly lower than their numbers would warrant, and *much* lower than blacks. Consider: black athletes dominate football, are an overwhelming presence in basketball, and have a smaller but still significant presence in baseball. Hispanics have a fairly large presence in baseball but otherwise fade into insignificance in sports. In movies, television and music, the black presence is practically orders of magnitude greater than the Hispanic (non)presence. Even in business and politics Hispanics are far less significant than blacks.

[Insider]

'Let's face it, whites need another ally in the (apparently imminent) race war with blacks.'

Lol. This is why HBD has a long way to go before gaining anything close to mainstream acceptance.

[Conquistador]

"Lol. This is why HBD has a long way to go before gaining anything close to mainstream acceptance." Insider

On the contrary the HBD community's perverse obsession to be high minded and avoid coming across as "racist" is why it's so irrelevant. The MRA's got labeled as hate sites by the $$$outhern Poverty Law Center recently because their vitriol is making waves and catching on. Extremists drive change moderates don't achieve shit. Our founders didn't frame the British as a great and noble civilization with whom they had political disagreements. Instead they painted them tyrannical blood thirsty murderers.

[Peter]

@ famously nameless:
While white people often are physically afraid of blacks, Hispanics don't seem to be. At least not to anywhere near the same extent.

[Park Slope Pubby]

In my observation: there are a lot of blacks that just want to work and be left alone. There is also an underclass.

Hispanics are almost entirely in the group that wants to work and be left alone. They don't have an underclass.

The uneducated stupider Hispanics work, and work hard, whether it's flat-fix or scullery work in the kitchen or picking strawberries. the uneducated stupider blacks turn into thugs.

The strange thing about this is that when it comes to politics, the uneducated stupid blacks are far more political than the uneducated stupid Hispanics. Uneducated stupid blacks have time on their hands to devote to million-hoodie marches (etc), and uneducated stupid blacks don't.

I think the way Hispanics will move on blacks is to take over their neighborhoods and, quietly, beat them up so they feel unwanted, and eventually move. But they won't develop any Reverend Als. And they won't be allying with whites, either.

[Matt in RTP]

If there are race riots, will we get any good music out of it? Recall that the Rodney King riots resulted in Sublime's "April 29, 1992", Ice Cube's "The Predator", and provided the inspiration for much of Dr. Dre's "The Chronic"...

I doubt there will be any SIGNIFICANT riots. Let me explain...

I was only 6 years old when the Rodney King riots touched off, so I have no real first-hand knowledge of the tenor of the times, but from reading on the riot and its aftermath, I have a feeling that Americans, both black and white, were in a very different place back then, even though it was merely 20 years ago.

White, suburban middle class people, really thought that this was 'it' -- the songs I listed above were the soundtrack to the collapse of civilization, violent crime reached its post-60s apex in 1991, AIDS and crack were still scary, not jokes, and NYC had yet to be turned into a playground for the SWPL hipsters.

The American people had had enough, and this meshed perfectly with Bill Clinton's 'triangulation' -- here was a Democrat pushing through welfare reform, portraying himself as hard on crime, refusing to lay the blame for urban dysfunction at the feet of "racist" whites, etc. It was a significant push-back against the permissive excesses of the late 60s/70s that was, funnily enough, orchestrated by the very same people who had enthusiastically partied and protested through the Age of Aquarius as young adults!

I don't sense the same frisson of white, middle-class fear/anger/outrage today, despite all the noise generated by the Tea Party activists. If there are ANY riots, they will be isolated incidents, and they won't have the same profound effects on the American body politic that the King (well, both Rodney and Martin!) did.

OT, but you could also blog about this, if you're interested -- the 'war' between the Baby Boomers and my generation, the Millenials:

http://www.esquire.com/features/young-people-in-the-recession-0412

Half Sigma, what generation do you consider yourself? Baby Boomer or Gen X?

And, finally, thank you for this blog. It is the only blog I make a habit of reading.

[g]

Guess what? Who do you think CNN has assigned to be the "moderator" of a discussion about race and the Martin-Zimmerman case?

Everybody's lil' racist Latina, Soledad O'Brien.
Heard it promoed as I was listening to results of today's SCOTUS proceedings.

Hmmm. With whom will the li' racist herself identify, being a wise Latina herself? Funny how things work, she and Zimmerman having bi-race and Euro surnames in common.

They need to invite the fired Rick Sanchez along for the ride. Maybe even invite over from Fox the suddenly repentent Geraldo Rivera. (Wow, did he fold like the pussy wuss I always knew he was behind all the machismo.)

[Mercy Vetsel]

I think you're doing us a huge service by blogging on this issue. It's precisely when the media most egregiously fails in their responsibility that it's important for bloggers to pick up the slack.

For all we know there could already have been murders that where partially inspired by these outrageous lies pushed as part of this pre-canned BOV narrative. According to the FBI, there is a little over one black on white murder every day. If an extra 10 whites have been murdered by blacks angered by this story broke would be lost as statistical noise.

You also make a good point about the Hispanic angle. I'm surprised that more people haven't been pointing out that a heroic HISPANIC man has been thrown to the wolves in the name of a false narrative.

I think it's time for Republicans to stand up for Hispanics who take incredible personal risks to keep their families and neighborhoods safe.

Zimmerman is a hero. If marginal middle-class neighborhoods had more people like him getting involved, kids like sweet little 12-year old Trayvon wouldn't be as likely to turn to violence, burglary, graffiti and drugs in their teens.

-Mercy

[Peter]

"I think the way Hispanics will move on blacks is to take over their neighborhoods and, quietly, beat them up so they feel unwanted, and eventually move"

That's pretty much what happened in Compton.

[Peter]

@ Matt in RTP -
I was an adult living in Connecticut at the time of the Rodney King riots, and coincidentally working in a mainly clerical job in a criminal courthouse. Not too many people I knew seemed to think of the riots as the impending Zombie Apocalypse. For the most part, the general zeitgeist was utter disgust at the LAPD's cowardice, at the way they'd turn and run whenever an angry crowd formed.

[Peter]

From Facebook, a very insightful suggestion why Hispanics haven't rallied to Zimmerman's side:

"Because they're ashamed he let this skinny black guy without a gun get the jump on him. I'm not kidding about this. The guy even screamed for help. Latinos want nothing to do with a big soft pussy like that."

[jay]

"I think this is a major event that has a lot of implications for the future of our nation, and I’m not entirely sure how it will turn out."

I agree with you about this, and I think you are doing a great job analyzing the incident. Keep it up.

I think the reason "Hispanics" haven't sided more with Zimmerman is that they aren't a cohesive group. He's not Mexican, Cuban or PR.

If blacks want to riot, let them. In fact, bring it on. They'll find a much less sympathetic country than the last time. I remember last time. I had sympathy for them as it was during the last dying embers of my liberalism. Not anymore. They can all drop dead for all I care.

[Crop]

"Because they're ashamed he let this skinny black guy without a gun get the jump on him. I'm not kidding about this. The guy even screamed for help. Latinos want nothing to do with a big soft pussy like that."

This is the point I keep trying to make, and the reason I side with Trayvon 1000%

[Channon Christopher]

They can all drop dead for all I care."

Hope the chance comes for me to help with that.

[Insider]

'On the contrary the HBD community's perverse obsession to be high minded and avoid coming across as "racist" is why it's so irrelevant.'

It's one thing to point out failed policy, and it's another thing to fearmonger. I believe there's a line between what can and can't count as acceptable propaganda in favor of a cause. Talking about race wars is over that line.

[Conquistador]

@ Insider

Look at South Africa and Rhodesia. That is the future of whites if they don't realize the stakes. Walking around with your head in the sand might be comforting for now.....until it's too late.

[Insider]

'Look at South Africa and Rhodesia. That is the future of whites if they don't realize the stakes.'

And why is that a given?

[Columnist]

Posted by: Park Slope Pubby | March 28, 2012 at 05:46 PM

Yes, the Hispanics won't ally with whites. But that will be little solace for the blacks.

[Conquistador]

"And why is that a given?" - Insider

Are you serious? Umm how about demographic replacement? I live in California and this state used to be a paradise now it mostly resembles a Mexican ghetto. How about history? Do you know how unpleasant the multicultural//multiethnic/multiracial empires were? There is always a pecking order and when you have groups fueled with resentment towards whitey what do you think happens when they take over? Whites in SA now fear being victims of genocide. People like you are dangerously naive.

[Insider]

'Are you serious? Umm how about demographic replacement? I live in California and this state used to be a paradise now it mostly resembles a Mexican ghetto.'

If you're trying to imply California is less prosperous on a per capita basis, that doesn't seem to be the case. http://www.dof.ca.gov/html/fs_data/latestecondata/FS_Income.htm

If you're trying to imply that whites are literally going to be 'replaced' by Hispanics, that day is a long way off and it assumes that current trends continue.

'Do you know how unpleasant the multicultural//multiethnic/multiracial empires were?'

No, I wasn't there to experience them. I can't say one way or the other if having a multi-cultural populace was the cause of 'unpleasantness.'

'Whites in SA now fear being victims of genocide'

So because this happened there, it is going to happen here? Nevermind the huge difference between the United States and South Africa.

'People like you are dangerously naive'

Either that, or I don't find your argument compelling. Let's just assume that when you have a population where blacks vastly outnumber whites, you get a South Africa. Even if that's the case, black population rates in the United States are stable. Hispanics, as HS has discussed time and again on this blog, are different than blacks. Bottom line: there isn't going to be a race war any time soon.

[Conquistador]

"If you're trying to imply California is less prosperous on a per capita basis, that doesn't seem to be the case." - insider.

Ah yes you're very much like our own elite. Quality of life doesn't matter instead esoteric statistics like GDP are fawned over. People are fleeing this state in droves. One of the reasons few talk about is the Mexicanization of California's prole and lower class neighborhoods. If you don't care about stuff that effects real people how about the fact that California is sinking in debt and can't balance a budget anymore due to the enormous strains on state finances the demographic shifts bave placed on them (welfare, prisons, schools, healthcare). California is getting poorer and poorer the more "diverse" it becomes.

"If you're trying to imply that whites are literally going to be 'replaced' by Hispanics, that day is a long way off and it assumes that current trends continue." -insider

Non-whites are already the majority in California. As stated above when you resemble the third world you also begin to emulate it's dysfunctionality. Even if the number of illegals entering ceases you still have tens of millions already here popping out kids and left and right. Do these kids become physicists at MIT? No they go onto be gang bangers and single mothers. Hell it's not even illegals that are the biggest problem it's actually their kids. So even if the trends discontinue as you say I don't see how that changes anything.

"No, I wasn't there to experience them. I can't say one way or the other if having a multi-cultural populace was the cause of 'unpleasantness.'" - imsider

Learn history. The USSR and Ottoman Empire are good examples. Or even more contemporary Iraq. Without a strongman dictator like Saddam to keep things in line with an iron fist things becomes nasty to put it mildly. These people look alike, speak the same language, and embrace the same religion (with some variation in sects) and yet they're at each others throats. In other words these people have a lot more in common than the demographic groups in the USA will and yet they can't even get along. What will happen here is anybody's guess but if history is any indication it won't be pleasant. Just look at all these "tough on crime", "war on drugs", and anti-terrorism type laws being enacted everywhere in the west. It's the inevitable consequence of "diversity". The image of a policeman of the past would be a friendly and unassuming man with only a revolver at his side. Nowadays it's a guy fully decked out in SWAT and combat with an assault rifle in hand. Basically when you become "multicultural" you need a police state to keep everything together.

"So because this happened there, it is going to happen here? Nevermind the huge difference between the United States and South Africa." - insider

Insane leftist ideology led a first world country to rapidly descend into third world status. It's happening here too wake the hell up.

"Either that, or I don't find your argument compelling. Let's just assume that when you have a population where blacks vastly outnumber whites, you get a South Africa. Even if that's the case, black population rates in the United States are stable. Hispanics, as HS has discussed time and again on this blog, are different than blacks. Bottom line: there isn't going to be a race war any time soon." - insider

Demographics are destiny. Half Sigma is also a resident of New York. He doesn't know shit about Mexicans. Do you know what La Raza is? It's a major hispanic lobby group. It's name translates into "the race". They openly talk about "retaking what was theirs" and are fueled with anti-white resentment. Even if the USA doesn't turn into SA it will resemble Latin America (specifically Mexico) which is almost equally as bad.

[ibejeph]

Conquistador, you are lost in your racial prejudices. Hispanics come here for a better life. Yes, some get involved with gangs but honestly, every race and cultural groups have their seedy underbelly. Some of the greatest mobsters were jewish or irish. It is by no means a significant proportion of the population.

The majority of hispanics are upwardly mobile, earning degrees and proving themselves in various careers. A huge number are 2nd or 3rd generation. It takes a few generations for a culture to change from hard working laborers to suit wearing paper pushers.

As for your feeling that the mentality of the latin world is something to fear, look at the democratic movements of south america. Without support of media, government or the USA, they've instilled real democratic change.

As a hispanic myself and to anwer Half Sigma, I find myself siding with Zimmerman. I'm home owner and I do not want my city overrun with thugs and drugs. If needed, I would join a neighborhood watch, to ensure a safe area and help property values. I'm working towards a college degree, I'm married and am considerate of my neighbors. I've also lost about 30 pounds, so I can relate to his fat picture as well.