What did Trayvon and DeeDee REALLY talk about?

As we know from the timeline (at least what those of us who actually follow the real facts of the case know), Trayon Martin and Zimmerman looked at each other, Martin ran away, and Zimmerman got out of his car. A few minutes later, Martin and Zimmerman were in a fight. In between those two events, Martin spoke on the phone to a girl identified only as “DeeDee” who happened to call him.

If what really happened is that Martin went back to confront Zimmerman after he evaded him (which is likely), then there’s a good possibility that the phone conversation with DeeDee is what caused Martin to change his mind.

I think there’s a possibility that DeeDee is lying about the whole incident, and that what really happened is that she told Martin to go kick Zimmerman’s ass after Martin told her that some guy who looks like he lived there was looking at him like he didn’t belong there.

This version of events would explain why DeeDee never told anyone about the phone call until the Martin family or Ben Crump found the call on Trayvon’s cell phone statement. It’s because she was complicit in getting Martin killed. She told him to beat up someone who turned out to be packing heat. You can see why she'd be motivated to make up a story that casts herself, as well as Martin, in a much more positive light.

There’s a long history of black women who lie about some incident in order to incriminate white people. I am thinking about Nafissatou Diallo who lied about the circumstance of her encounter with Dominique Strauss-Kahn, Crystal Mangum who lied about being raped by Duke lacrosse players, and Tawana Brawley who at the age of 15 lied about being raped by a bunch of white men.

Comments

[PlutoLives!]

I think you're right. Dee Dee herself could have called 911. , the whole bit about Trayvon lying in the morgue as a John Doe for 3 days...it just doesn't wash with me. Why didn't the parents ask the girlfriend from the jump? If my son were missing and I knew he had a girlfriend, she'd be the first person I'd ask. Also, why didn't DeeDee mention that Trayvon was supposedly being followed by a strange man before their call got disconnected? Yep, HS you're on to something!

[Rivelino]

good stuff HS

[MC]

One thing I haven't seen you mention yet is the fact that Judge Lester let Zimmerman out on bail. That is an extremely good sign for Zimmerman that Lester is going to be a reasonably judge. A judge that just wanted to railroad would never have granted bail.

[Doug1]

I never thought of that. You could be right.

Or she might have asked Trayvon why he didn't just confront the guy, after asking how big he was, without tell him to beat him up. Though she should have realized that was a real possibility.

I've always thought at a minimum that DeeDee's account of the interchange she heard between Trayvon and Zimmerman was a sanitized version of what she heard. For one thing it sounded very white: "Why are you following me?" followed by Zimmerman's response "what are you doing around here?" Cleaned up for her by Crump no doubt. I also think she left out the anger in Trayvon's voice.

[Turambar]

Off Topic:

Senator Joe Manchin is unwilling to say he'd vote for Obama.

This guy is ripe to be plucked into Romney's VP

http://hotair.com/archives/2012/04/20/manchin-i-may-not-vote-for-obama-in-november/

[Jennifer Caplan-Jones]

I really do believe that Trayvon was trying to impress Deedee in some sick way. Running away from George and just going home would have made him seem like a coward. I think this kid had a reputation to uphold with his girlfriend who no doubt had ties to his old school which he would have been going back to once his suspension was up. He wanted to "be the man" who could brag later on about beating some older's guy @ss but instead, he got a taste of his own street justice.

To Pluto Lives: Love that name by the way. Your name is an ode to the planet not the dog, I presume?

Anyhow, blacks have this stupid philosophy about "no snitching". Assuming Crump's version of events is true, this girl was going to take all of this to her grave. If she had told of what transpired between Tray and George, she would have been "snitching".

[KLO]

It seems implausible to me DeeDee would egged on a reluctant Martin. If Martin was initially hesitant to confront Zimmerman, I am guessing that Martin would not have described the situation to DeeDee in a way that made him look cowardly to her. It seems more plausible that Martin wanted to confront Zimmerman and DeeDee:

(1) encouraged an already game Martin;
(2) did not try to discourage Martin; or
(3) tried to discourage Martin, but now feels like she could have done more.

In all three scenarios, there is reason enough for her to avoid calling the police when shit went down or sometime thereafter. Furthermore, when she realizes that Martin is dead, she will retell the story in a way that is most sympathetic to him and to her.

What I would like answered is:

(a) when did the call with DeeDee begin and end according to cell phone records; and
(b) why did the police not try to contact her sooner?

[Inkraven]

Someone (I think it was over at Gucci Little Piggy) found her Twitter page a while back. for his girlfriend, she was so devastated that she was able to go shoe shopping a day or two after she found out Martin was dead.

Someone should definitely go dig up that page before it gets sanitized.

[jon]

Speaking of Nafissatou Diallo, whose immigration status is very dubious, she is still in NYC, having had no repercussions from her lies. Same for Jose Antonio Vargas, an illegal immigrant who broke many laws over many years who our criminal authority simply refuse to deport. He is, instead, on a lecture circuit, getting paid big money from diversicrats.

[Conquistador]

"I think there’s a possibility that DeeDee is lying about the whole incident, and that what really happened is that she told Martin to go kick Zimmerman’s ass" - Half Sigma

An example of matriarchy at work where women rule through sexual fiat and the men obey or else they lose sexual access.

[destructure]

I've always thought Deedee was being ~less than forthright~ about her conversation with Tray. But I'm reluctant to speculate without something substantive to back it up.

[Conquistador]

"Nafissatou Diallo, whose immigration status is very dubious, she's still in NYC, having had no repercussions from her lies."

Women never face repercussions for false rape accusations as the MRAs have repeatedly documented. The few times they do is when they bite off more than they can chew by going after a wealthy, powerful, high status man. Then the dirt about their own background is revealed. Diallo's example is recent but Kobe Bryant's accuser was also exposed for being a mentally deranged slut who's underwear was stained with a variety of male semen.

[m]

We don't know that DeeDee is black, do we?

Her name sounds as if she might be white, but your point about girls egging on boys to fight is well-taken,

I suspect DeeDee knows very little, but a cross-examination of her might be very enlightening.

I'll also be interested in finding out if TM was part of a boys' "fight club" for if he was, I suspect that he might have gotten a good look at GZ who was walking, determined he was quite short and older than himself, decided it would be quite exciting to confront him, then try out his fists on him. Being a dumb teenager, he wouldn't have given a thought to GZ being armed.

Otherwise, it seems clear that TM had a clear path "home" and if he didn't want to see or deal with the guy whom he said was following him, he didn't have to at all.

It's called testosterone. It gets lots of males in trouble, esp. when they are young.

[Half Canadian]

I'm not quite ready to follow you there, but I do think that she isn't representing her conversation with Trayvon accurately.

I'd like to see what her phone records look like after her call with Trayvon.

If she testifies, the defense can subpoena her phone records. That's the only way we'll find out.

[Park Slope Pubby]

Another possibility, based on my own emotional history (and I've been happily married for 30 years): they had a bad fight. He was so angry he took it out on the first person who came along. Maybe she dumped him. Whatever, he was itching for a fight. He's a 16 year old man, for heaven's sakes, they do crazy things when they get dumped by their girlfriends.

[Prof. Woland]

Two angles to this story that need exploring are that Trayvon Martin could have doubled back because he did not want Zimmerman to know where he lived. He could also have had a reason for not wanting to be at home. These two possibilities are pure speculation on my part but if his house was only 70 yards away from where the shooting took place, TM could have easily run there in 10 or 12 seconds well before GZ had caught up with him. He probably suspected GZ was lurking around somewhere trying to find him. But if GZ walked around the corner just as TM was walking into his house, then GM would now know where to find him if there was any future trouble. If little Tray planned on laying low while out on his suspension the last thing he needed was for a do gooder like GZ busting him for smoking a little dope or lifting merchandise from people’s backyards. Another aspect to this is they perhaps TM had something to fear or loath about his father or his family. There could have been something profoundly discomforting to TM about his new living quarters and was therefore not so eager to go there.

[The great one]

Don't white have a stop snitching code as well. Think the Catholic priests , Jerry sandusky,

[Liberty]

The crew over at the Treehouse has been trying to sort out the DeeDee story, since none of it rang true.

It would appear that they have done a fairly good job of tracking down a young lady who could plausibly be "DeeDee" (iAdoree-Dee) and investigating what she was doing on the critical highlights of the timeline according to Crump.

http://theconservativetreehouse.com/2012/04/21/update-10-part-2-the-trayvon-martin-shooting-deedee-reveals-the-false-truths/#more-37932

I hope everyone involved in this case who tried to railroad Zimmerman and was more interested in political power and/or financial gain than the TRUTH gets sued into oblivion when the dust settles. That includes all the media hacks who completely fabricated evidence to support a narrative they desperately wanted to believe.

[James Crawford]

I would still like to know if there are any phone records or call logs to confirm that this phone call even occurred. After showing the carefully edited 911 tape to impugn Zimmerman as a racist then they blurred police station video with the suggestion that there was no visible evidence of injurie, I wouldn't trust the media or Martin's lawyers on this.

I just discovered this site which has better info than the LMS, so may be the phone call has been confirmed?

[destructure]

Conquistador

The charges against DSK and Kobe were dismissed. That's not the same as innocent. There are plenty of crimes not prosecuted due to lack of evidence. You don't get accused of rape as many times as DSK for no reason. As for Kobe, you need to read the statement he made as part of the agreement for his accuser dismissing the charges.

I agree with you half the time. The rest of the time... not so much. That's particularly true when you get into this MRA/PUA nonsense. Not that MRA/PUA types don't make some reasonable points. But they carry it too far the way feminists carry it too far. You're both two sides of the same bitter coin. And I think this video probably explains your attitude.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CkoMbxHQmuM

[sabril]

"I really do believe that Trayvon was trying to impress Deedee in some sick way."

Just speculating, but I think this is probably correct. All men have an instinct to not lose face by backing down in front of their girls. Probably in Trayvon Martin's case, that instinct would have been very intense.

It's also interesting that Zimmerman had stared at Martin earlier. So probably at an animal level, Martin felt that he was having a dominance contest with Zimmerman. (If anyone doesn't believe me, try starting at a young black man some time and see what happens.)

[.]

if someone's following you, you don't lead them to your home.

[Raffik]

"There’s a long history of blacks who lie."

Fixed that for you.

[Conquistador]

"You don't get accused of rape as many times as DSK for no reason." - destructure

DSK is a lothario and political figure. That's not a good combination. Opponnets of various stripes can easily drum up accusations by bitter ex lovers as they did against Bill Clinton who was also accused of sexual harassment and rape.

"As for Kobe, you need to read the statement he made as part of the agreement for his accuser dismissing the charges."

I doubt Kobe has to resort to rape. His accuser was bragging about her tryst at a party a few days before charges were filed.

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=956

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x28421

[m]

"if someone's following you, you don't lead them to your home."

If you are actually scared and not making a game out of something, you
1) Go home if there a way to conceal your path home (and there appears to have been several townhouses and paths that TM could have used to avoid GZ maintaining eye contact--see the blog The WAgist in order to see several google map angles)

2) CAll 911 if you have a phone (TZ did) and if you feel that threatened.

It's called using your head.

[mikeca]

There is a huge amount of speculation in this thread.

We know that GZ got out of his car and was running or jogging after TM. We know that TM knew he was being chased at night by some strange man. When TM approached GZ and asked him why he was following him, GZ gave a non-responsive answer that did not explain his actions. There are two versions of the conversation. One from GZ's father and another from TM's girlfriend, but in neither version does GZ say anything to address TM's justifiable fear of being chased at night by a strange man.

GZ was carrying his handgun in a holster in his waist band. It is possible that during this conversation TM noticed the handgun. GZ says he reached for his cell phone and TM punched him in the face. Did TM see his gun and think he was reaching for his gun?

Florida statue 776.012 says:

"A person is justified in using force, except deadly force, against another when and to the extent that the person reasonably believes that such conduct is necessary to defend himself or herself or another against the other’s imminent use of unlawful force."

If TM thought that GZ was reaching for his gun, this statue authorizes punching him in the nose.

Anyone who goes running after strangers at night carrying a hand gun in their waist band should know that their behavior is threatening. When TM asked GZ why he was chasing him, GZ should have identified himself as a neighborhood watch volunteer and indicated that the police were on the way.

I think GZ is guilty of manslaughter for his reckless behavior with a hand gun. I can't see a 2nd degree murder conviction given the facts we know.

[destructure]

Conquistador

No one is accused of rape as many times as DSK without a reason. Several of the women were highly respected and credible with no romantic ties to him. And nothing to gain by making the accusations. DSK's abuses were an open secret among his acquaintances. In fact, he's already in trouble again for sexual misconduct. The guy has a problem. Clinton did, too.

As for athletes not needing to "rape" anyone, he was married and his wife was smoking hot. So you wouldn't think he'd need to cheat on her either. But he did. If you google athlete + rape you'll get 5,820,000 results. Rape is a huge problem among athletes.

I think there is something about very competitive men that makes them more likely to rape, cheat and womanize. I don't think it has anything to do with "having to resort" to it. I think its just part of their competitive nature.

[Tanizaki]

"We know that GZ got out of his car and was running or jogging after TM."

The investigator who testified at the bond hearing did not seem to know that. Why do you?

[Klynexx]

"Why didn't the parents ask the girlfriend from the jump? If my son were missing and I knew he had a girlfriend, she'd be the first person I'd ask. Also, why didn't DeeDee mention that Trayvon was supposedly being followed by a strange man before their call got disconnected?"

That's the thing. She wasn't his girlfriend. She probably wasn't even a friend. She was at best a casual acquaintance or she could have been someone tray was trying to pursue romantically. My guess is the latter. What better way to score points than by winning a fight. The fact that this chick went shoe shopping just days after he died tells you she didn't think that much of Tray from the get go. People do some crazy things in the name of like, love and lust.

Crump is really laying it on thick in his attempts to score pity points for this case. He's been manipulating MSM and the rest of the blacks with this "unarmed black boy killed by rcist white man" schtick for a while. He's a civil lawyer!!! I don't know why people aren't seeing through the facade. I think this man could care less about Trayvon or his parents. He's going for the money and he's laid the groundwork to get it. Black people are so blinded by race that they can't see they're being "had".

[mikeca]

"We know that GZ got out of his car and was running or jogging after TM."

"The investigator who testified at the bond hearing did not seem to know that. Why do you?"

You can hear GZ's heavy breathing on the 911 tape. The 911 operator hears this too and asks if he is following him. Maybe GZ was so out of shape that just walking caused heavy breathing, but he does not look that out of shape to me.