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May 17, 2012

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“If the U.S. depended on white births alone, we’d be dead,” Mr. Myers said. “Without the contributions from all these other groups, we would become too top-heavy with old people.”

Somewhere Richard Easterlin points out that when dealing with this issue, you have to look at all dependents, not just old people dependents. Once you add all those children who aren't working to the dependent side of the equation, it's a lot less clearcut how many births you want to maximize your productive-population to dependent-population ratio.

The problem in the United States and world is this:

The least productive people are most reproductive.

I don't know how much more bad news I can take.

People who immigrate to the US tend to come from nations where routine infant circumcision is rare and where drinking water is not fluoridated. These immigrants possible have tons of kids abroad then immigrate to the US. Also, birth rates of the next generation of the immigrants tend to drop over time, which is possible partly due to routine infant circumcision, water fluoridation and other toxins that are banned most other nations but not in the US.


Does this represent a door shutting?

There is this idea that Ghey Marriage is inevitable. For instance this quote re the NC Marriage Admendment:
"State House Speaker Thom Tillis, a Republican from a Charlotte suburb, said earlier in the day that even if the amendment passed, it would be reversed as today's young adults age -- within 20 years. "It's a generational issue," Tillis told a student group at North Carolina State University in March about the amendment he supports."

However, Ruy Teixeira's demographic wave means that the country will shift to Hispanic's and Blacks who are vastly opposed to this.

The high water mark for this might be in the next 5 to 10 years and then the door slams shut as the fecundity of the masculine cultures overwhelms the lack of gene continuation of Teh Gheys.

And at some point these minorities are going to get pissed off at getting attacked by liberals. Hispanic hero Manny Pacquiao gets banned and attacked by California Gheys for offering a religious opinion.

We're screwed unless the Republicans start acting like Democrats and promote policies designed to increase the number of white people born, like the Democrats do for minorities. Instead of pandering to other groups, Republicans would do better to start growing more of their own.

India is a very diverse country.

[HS: That's like saying that Europe is a very diverse continent. However, the fact that white Americans come from all countries in Europe is NOT considered diversity.

A child born today won't even reach peak productivity (say ages 25-40) until after the boomers swelled medicare.

The US will be just another New World shit hole like Brazil, Mexico, etc.

By measures more realistic than per capita GDP it is already a poor country.

With net immigration from Mexico having turned negative this may be a temporary thing.

A few days prior to the New York Times' jubilant celebration of America's vibrant racial diversity, it reported that New York City schools are the third most segregated in the U.S.:

"Half the city’s 1,600-plus schools are over 90 percent black and Hispanic." Many of those schools have ZERO non-Hispanic white students.

"A Portrait of Segregation"
http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2012/05/11/nyregion/segregation-in-new-york-city-public-schools.html

"The problem in the United States and world is this:

The least productive people are most reproductive."

The very ideas of "productive" and "unproductive" are meaningless outside the context of the industrial revolution and the population explosion.

And now in late stage capitalism although IQ is somewhat heritable and somewhat valid in explaining productivity productive occupations are luxuries.

There is still no appreciation among the elite except for Robert Reich of how much so few produce and how many can get by producing nothing and do.

Just because it's hard and requires a credential and pays doesn't make it work!

"Just because it's hard and requires a credential and pays doesn't make it work!"

Shh, we can't let poor people figure out the scam. (as I post from work in which I did nothing all day and make an upper middle class salary)

"Shh, we can't let poor people figure out the scam. (as I post from work in which I did nothing all day and make an upper middle class salary)"

No idea what I'm talking about, obviously.

What do you do exactly? Better than even money it's not productive.

Most make work pays poorly, but not all. For example most of medicine, law, and financial services is unproductive or at best solves problems man has made for himself rather than problems of nature. Engineers working in defense or working for Apple are unproductive.


Here's what I see happening.

Because whites tend to only have children they can invest in, their kids will get great educations and top all the important fields in our society. Nonwhites with near-white skin tones, such as Hispanics, Asians, and Middle Easterners, will also climb to the top and occupy top management positions.

There will be a lot of black/brown people, but since their parents don't put the same resources into raising their kids, and because they're at an aesthetic disadvantage for not looking like the current dominant race, they'll just end up with the low-level jobs or occasional middle-management positions.

Under this arrangement, white people and the select minorities will make way more money than everyone else and will be able to continue living in segregated communities where their interaction with black/brown people will be limited.

Love it, this will make my life easier since I am competing less competitive people. If you are at bottom, you are screwed.

Socialism was good for working class whites in South Africa until apartheid ended and white socialism gone. But middle class and upper class whites actually benefits from ending of apartheid.

"Because whites tend to only have children they can invest in, their kids will get great educations and top all the important fields in our society."

There are a lot of poor, single, white women punching out babies right now. Read the big NYT article from February about single moms.

Charles Murray's latest book talks about Belmont vs. Fishtown. There are a lot of Fishtown whites, probably the majority of whites are that way. Just because you don't see them doesn't mean they don't exist.

"[HS: That's like saying that Europe is a very diverse continent. However, the fact that white Americans come from all countries in Europe is NOT considered diversity."

Poor analogy. Europeans are all white. India by contrast consist of 3 main races ( Europeans, non-white caucasoids, and proto-australoids ) all mixed together to varying degrees and varying proportions (depending on the caste)

Here's one thing I wonder. What happens if Europe goes downhill? Do many Europeans try to come to the US? Or do they opt instead for Australia, NZ and Canada, among others?

Like if you're a fairly well educated, but young Greek guy. Suppose you've got a good education, speak decent English, and are 26. You look around and figure, you know, Greece is fucked. Where do you go? I guess stay in the EU for visa reasons, or do you look to far off lands? Is the US too restrictive of legal immigrants?

What happens when the contagion spreads? Do Spanish people go to South America?

Ah! "rare" infant circumcision gives high birth rate?
Really?
Not in Belgium at least:
http://smotri.com/video/view/?id=v20438309a6d

It's unfortunate that the writer neglects that the majority of these "minority" births are out of wedlock and causes increased rate of poverty, criminality, alcoholism, drug abuse and repeated behavior of becoming single parents themselves.

Single parents should be publically shamed, not encouraged by similar idiots and the government who likes to be the surrogate father.

"The least productive people are most reproductive."

True, what else are they going to do? They are too ignorant to value education, have insurance to buy and use birth control. Most Proles have no concept of future time orientation, delayed satisfaction and consequences of their present stupidity.

I especially love how single mothers say they will go back to school once they have a child or two, as if raising a child isn't a full-time job and they have enough money invested to attend school and hire babysitters for 4 years.

"Of the total births in the year that ended last July, about 26 percent were Hispanic, about 15 percent black, and about 4 percent Asian."

Asians are not producing their share of babies. Asians are 4.8% of the population. I feel if Asian percentage reaches around 10%, America will no longer be a White country in occupations that are lucrative and require high intelligence.

"Socialism was good for working class whites in South Africa until apartheid ended and white socialism gone. But middle class and upper class whites actually benefits from ending of apartheid."

Not sure this is true in regards to South Africa.

South Africa has lost much of its middle level of talent, as white South Africans, both English and Afrikaner, have decamped for Australia, Canada, UK, NZ, etc -- something on the order of 1 to 1.5 million college-educated people have left since 1994.

The may things we can do is to continue to proliferate fairness and at the same time limit immigration and increase sexual activity. Limit foreign born foreigners from entering our country while embracing the existing foreign born we have here. Celebrate fertility for everyone and do more on your own ends as well. That's the best way to do it. We don't need policies from government to reproduce, we just do.

So it's better to stop talking and start doing it.

I like the idea of having lots of foreign born high-functioning people. They get a lot of hate from middle and working class white folks because they must compete harder and harder, but that's precisely the reason why we need more foreign born people.

[HS: That's like saying that Europe is a very diverse continent. However, the fact that white Americans come from all countries in Europe is NOT considered diversity.]

Someone already beat me to it, but...

Right, America is more diverse than each European country.

India is like a European Union or a Soviet Union in that there are many ethnic groups. And then within each ethnic group, you have different races and different religions.

The comment in the original post said that India is homogenous like Germany and China. No way.

yan shen, asian supremacist troll:
"They get a lot of hate from middle and working class white folks because they must compete harder and harder, but that's precisely the reason why we need more foreign born people."

funny how well america did in the early- to mid-20th century when it was 90% white european. perhaps china needs more foreign born creative and moral whites to help them invent things on their own and mold a government that isn't anachronistically communist and corrupt to the core? what say you, yanny-boy?

What will happen when enough older whites have died off and a majority of the voting age population is nonwhite? Will the nonwhites vote to continue Social Security and Medicare payments to the elderly mostly white retirees who they aren't related to? I would not rely on either of those two programs being there during my retirement. I plan to work as long as I can, possibly around 75 or so. I'm also working lots of overtime right now and buying gold with the extra money I make and then I'm planning to sell that gold when I'm retired to help cover expenses. This plan may not work but it's better than not having any plan at all and, unless I can think of something better, it'll have to do.

Well said, Roissy. I can picture white-guilted liberals across America celebrating upon reading the news...

Let's talk solutions; what can realistically be done at this point? It seems that even if birthright citizenship rights were to be removed, it'd be too late now.

"funny how well america did in the early- to mid-20th century when it was 90% white european."

America at this time had the highest rate of immigration in this country's history. It's funny how you assumed that immigrants are all non-white. America 100 years ago was grungy, unequal, and teeming with people speaking languages other than English. That's what made it so great.

My argument is that having lots of foreign born immigrants prevent whites from sinking into complacency - you cannot slack off and still have a stable job and send your children to white-majority public schools. It frightens Americans to hustle around and be productive. High degree of ethnic heterogeneity also tends to discourage the creation of a strong welfare state - as previous commenters have pointed out, people tend not to want to provide social services to people unlike themselves. I believe that the decline of Europe and Japan is fueled by complacency caused by relative ethnic homogeneity and generous soical welfare programs.

China doesn't count because its people can by no means slack off and still be in the global middle class (except for a few lucky ones).

@Nicolai Yezhov:

"By measures more realistic than per capita GDP it is already a poor country."

Could be interesting, I'm agnostic about this.

Care to back up your assertion with facts?

The NYTs is anti-White, to the point that they really do come off as genocidal in their hatred for Whites. They even go so far as to provide historic reasons why destruction of White countries is justified! When you are providing "justifications" for why wiping out a group of people is OK, you have crossed a moral Rubicon.

RandomMedStudent,

Can you prove, "that the decline of Europe and Japan is fueled by complacency caused by relative ethnic homogeneity and generous soical welfare programs."

What do you mean by decline? Japan has the third largest economy in the world, Germany the fourth. Finland, Sweden and Norway are doing pretty well too.

GMR Writes: "Here's one thing I wonder. What happens if Europe goes downhill? Do many Europeans try to come to the US? Or do they opt instead for Australia, NZ and Canada, among others?"

Unless they already had family in one of those other countries, my guess is that the US would still be the number one destination. However we make it devilishly hard for someone like your example to come here. Most of US immigration is the result of "Chain immigration." We are prioritizing the relatives of other recent immigrants.

So young educated people who don't already have a hook up to come to the US will be going to Australia, Canada, or New Zealand. Those countries want educated immigrants.

yanny trolls for renminbi:

"America at this time had the highest rate of immigration in this country's history."

of mostly white europeans.

"It's funny how you assumed that immigrants are all non-white."

since 1965, they have been.

"America 100 years ago was grungy, unequal,"

so were most places 100 years ago.

"and teeming with people speaking languages other than English."

white european languages. not much chinese by comparison, i'm afraid. you seem caught up on this language thing. you do realize that genetic heritage goes deeper than inherited language? if you want to master the art of trolling, you gotta make your calculated ignorance a little more believable. or is this point too... inscrutable for you to get?

"That's what made it so great."

so your theory is that a multitude of languages is what makes a country great? papua new guinea called; they want their lost prosperity back.

***“If the U.S. depended on white births alone, we’d be dead,” Mr. Myers said. “Without the contributions from all these other groups, we would become too top-heavy with old people.” ***

The UK select committe on economic affairs noted the flaws in this argument. As noted above, it assumes a static retirement age despite improving medicine/health care and overlooks that the immigrants will also grow old.

http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/ld200708/ldselect/ldeconaf/82/82.pdf

I spotted an HBD comment:

"Josh Hill ..

For the umpteenth time, "Hispanic" is not a race, it is an ethnicity. Hispanics come in every race, just like here. A Hispanic immigrant doesn't necessarily change the racial makeup of this country any more than a European one does.

It is patently absurd to suggest that the blame for the failure of the children of Hispanic immigrants to do well in school is to be laid at the feet of white Americans. The children of Asian immigrants do better than "white" children in the same schools.

Nowhere does the article mention the issue of IQ. Current Hispanic immigrants are typically from the rural poor. Their IQ's appear to be significantly below average. And IQ correlates strongly with academic success.

This is not an issue of race or color. Those are superficialities. It is an issue of culture and IQ."

***High degree of ethnic heterogeneity also tends to discourage the creation of a strong welfare state - as previous commenters have pointed out, people tend not to want to provide social services to people unlike themselves. ***

@ RandomMedicalStudent.

True, but what do low achieving groups tend to vote for? More welfare and state support. If you import large numbers of those groups they will vote for parties that support those policies.

Of course it may end up being unsustainable because there are too many dependents, but why would you want that situation to arise?

Tino Sanandaji has blogged quite a bit on this.

"Poor minorities are loyal supporters of the left almost everywhere, including countries such as Sweden where immigration policy has frequently been more generous during right-of-center governments. Between 2000 and 2006, when the Social Democrats were in power, Sweden took an average of 60.000 immigrants per year. After the right took power in 2006, average immigration increased to 100.000 per year. Yet in the 2010 election 77% pf non-European immigrants voted for the left."

http://super-economy.blogspot.co.nz/2011/09/more-on-bryan-caplan-ethnic-diversity.html

Further to the above, this recent paper has a surprisingly candid discussion of the risks to political and social co-operation from increased ethnic diversity and low IQ immigration raising dependency.

Biology, Immigration, and Public Policy, Christainsen, Kyklos, Vol. 65, Issue 2, pp. 164-178, 2012

http://tinyurl.com/879wakw

"Most make work pays poorly, but not all. For example most of medicine, law, and financial services is unproductive or at best solves problems man has made for himself rather than problems of nature. Engineers working in defense or working for Apple are unproductive."

Nicolai

I am wondering if you are referring at all to things that Ivan Illich discussed in Tools For Conviviality and Medical Nemesis.

There is so much work that is wasted on things we don't need.Corporations are making things we don't need and at the same time making the people who work for them sick and mentally ill.

How many products damage us from pop that ruins our teeth to cars that maim and kill us.?

yan shammed:
"My argument is that having lots of foreign born immigrants prevent whites from sinking into complacency"

and my argument is that your argument is stupid. america had an immigration timeout for much of the early to mid-20th century and she did just fine in the productivity and verve department.

"you cannot slack off and still have a stable job and send your children to white-majority public schools."

since the general slacking off seems to be increasing with the influx of immigrants circa 1965, perhaps you need to rethink the direction your theory takes you? just a zen thought, not a sermon.

"It frightens Americans to hustle around and be productive."

it frightens chinese to think for themselves. see how proof by assertion works?

"I believe that the decline of Europe and Japan is fueled by complacency caused by relative ethnic homogeneity and generous soical welfare programs."

complacency is more likely a symptom of heterogeneity, if you follow the immigration timelines correctly.

"China doesn't count"

how convenient!

"because its people can by no means slack off and still be in the global middle class (except for a few lucky ones)."

no, i really think china needs more white europeans to infuse its culture with vibrancy, honest government and creativity. this is how the chinese will avoid slacking off.

What this all means is the mother of all spoils wars, coming very soon, well to where you live!

Hispanics don't have magic wombs. They just have far more kids at 16 than Whites and Asians. Having a kid at 16 is an economic disaster, you depend on wealth transfers from Whites who delay having their own kids, to pay for yours. And your kid's kids.

Meanwhile real wealth is created by digging stuff out of the ground, growing it, or making it. None of which requires strong backs and a willingness to work. Places like Detroit or Santa Ana would starve to death within weeks not months without constant welfare.

A shrinking White population which produces 95% of the Wealth will see its wealth taxed more and more and more, while non-Whites demand ever greater groveling by Whites and more special privileges for themselves. The whole system will run out of money very, very soon. Like ten years from now at the outside maybe fifteen.

Thus the mother of all spoils battles. NOT Brazil, the poor in Brazil are far poorer and more tolerant of real poverty, i.e. starvation, than the US non-White poor who will go from Third World middle class to starvation in ten days flat once the money fails. Which it will.

Hence some spark, some incident, a jury finding a Zimmerman not guilty, or a non-White mob lynching a Zimmerman, sparking off a great nationwide riot that just ... expands. Into full blown spoils wars, looting, etc. Which means numbers matched against Beta Male willingness to endure horribleness (War in Industrial conditions) and technology enhanced killing. The very beta-maleness of Beta Males makes them deadly soldiers, able to tolerate conditions the "warriors" cannot. And do things like pilot planes or drones, or zero in artillery, and the like. Paul Tibbets, his crew, and J Robert Oppenheimer and his crew were the epitome of beta males. And they were far more deadly than the greatest of warriors.

What this amounts to is money. Lack of it. Demand for it. And the shrinking White population determined to keep it. Even Sex and the City watching "modern urban White girls" don't want to send 85% of their money to Shaniqua in the Ghetto or Maria in the Barrio to feed their kids at the expense of their buying Manolo Blahniks or whatever stupid-ass shoe is fashion that moment.

CH, you're so adamantly against marriage and children, yet you publicly decry our demographical predicament. Don't you think it's somewhat contradictory?

In my opinion, naturally reducing our population can actually be good, as long as we don't just let immigrants fill in to make up for it.
Nothing wrong with having fewer people around: we can tear old, ugly buildings and have more open space, land available for recreational use and natural parks. Among many everyday advantages, there would be less traffic and natural resources would last longer.
But, of course, living in an age where countries in Africa seem to double their population every few decades, sub-replacement fertility rate in the West can be disastrous when combined with such permissive immigration policy.

"perhaps china needs more foreign born creative and moral whites to help them invent things on their own and mold a government that isn't anachronistically communist and corrupt to the core? what say you, yanny-boy?"

America is just as corrupt as china. You're dreaming otherwise. Laws made by corporations that give a giant middle finger to everyone who is not rich. Laws made in america that america applies unilaterally to the world at large and screw the sovereignty of other foreign nations.

Not to get too far of topic, but your comment about liberals always blaming white Americans for the enslavement of blacks and the genocide of American Indians got me thinking. Why aren't all the other North, South, and Central American nations ever criticized for these things. They were just as culpable, and sometimes moreso than the U.S. For example, Brazil imported more black slaves than the United States. The Spanish and their descendants killed far more Native Americans than the English and their descendants. Even today Indians in the Amazon are regularly murdered by the government and corporations. Do you ever here Anti-Americans in Europe or elsewhere attack Canada or Colombia for genocide, no it's only the dastardly U.S. Blacks in Latin America are treated horribly and Indians are treated even worse. Many races and nations were involved in these crimes(don't forget about the Arab slave trade of both Europeans and Africans which was much larger than the Atlantic trade). We shouldn't constantly prostrate ourselves when the rest of the world has been just as bad(without doing nearly as much good as us).

"In my opinion, naturally reducing our population can actually be good, as long as we don't just let immigrants fill in to make up for it."

i agree. the theory of economic growth and vitality through population expansion, taken to its logical conclusion, would mean that infinity humans will be needed at some point to keep the engine running. it's a stupid way of thinking, and not sustainable at any rate.

in fact, contra the assertions of the open borders aka anti-white bigots crowd who insist an influx of young immigrants is needed to buttress the declining white birth rate, it's actually more likely that white birth rate will rebound on its own in a majority white nation with plenty of open space and affordable neighborhoods. a high trust environment, coupled with the bonhomie that arises from living amongst people similar to oneself, usually does wonders for the inclination of people to start families.

1) This piece is propaganda.

The CDC data - based on an *actual* count of all births recorded by American hospitals and not based off this Census projection (I'm assuming, btw, that the New York Times is both reporting the Census data properly and is competent at basic math...) - for 2010 had whites still the majority of births by a few percentage points and actually increasing a bit because of the fall in Hispanic births (although ~10% of Hispanic births are born to ethnically European Hispanic women).

Hispanic births have actually fallen by over 100,000 since 2007. If all illegal aliens were deported that would drop Hispanic births by about 300,000-400,000.

2) Eduardo Saverin's renunciation of US citizenship is a reminder that immigrants (with citizenship or greencards can emigrate, as well as immigrate.

It's time to start working on promoting an HBD EMIGRATION policy of paying non-whites a lump sum (let's say $100,000 per family member) to formally renounce American citizenship and return to the ancestral third world nation.

If Saverin can turn in his citizenship and head for Singapore and Brazil (to avoid paying US taxes on his Facebook IPO) then there's no reason why we can't get tens of millions of non-whites to cash in their citizenship for a 100k.

Although, I suspect Saverin was more economically productive for the US and intelligent than the average Indio standing in front of Home Depot or Pakistani "American" mother strolling through Walmart with foodstamps in hand.

Proposed name for an HBD Emigration System: "Operation Saverin"

Society needs to have some amount of poverty and low productive people to function smoothly. Who's going to wipe your ass when you are 90 years old and demented? Who's going to pick strawberries?

Do Jews count as "white" people too? (They are more of middle eastern - european hybrids)
How about Hispanics with mostly european ancestry?
How about Arabs? (Caucasoids but not "white" in most people's minds)

To The Undiscovered Jew | May 18, 2012 at 11:27 AM

Derbyshire:
http://johnderbyshire.com/April2012/page.html#manyone
--------------------
Comment: (by J.D.) Here is a typical example of an extremely common response. (I took it from the comment thread on my April 12 TakiMag column, but there are dozens like it elsewhere — given the web-wide volume of commentary on this piece, quite likely hundreds.)

"Please tell this black woman who is a devoted mother, professional woman, cat lover, and gardener, and Ivy league graduate about her inherent nature and intelligence. Do tell!"

Now, it's well known that I hate to give offense — ask anybody! — but the temptation to say the obvious thing here is so strong, I am just going to yield to it.

Ma'am: If you cannot distinguish between a statistical statement about a population ("On average, men are taller than women") and a statement about some one particular member of that population ("Sally's real tall"), then … how intelligent do you expect me to believe you are, actually?

And if a person who cannot make that elementary logical distinction truly does have an Ivy League degree, Affirmative Action is a greater evil than I thought.
--------------------

Dear TUJ ! This is how Saverin case is related to the general demographic problem.

Respectfully submitted by Florida resident.

yan sham wowed!:
"Society needs to have some amount of poverty and low productive people to function smoothly."

is this a fact or a hypothesis?

"Who's going to wipe your ass when you are 90 years old and demented?"

were nurses non-existent in America before the 1965 "open borders to the yan shen world" act was passed?

"Who's going to pick strawberries?"

machines.

"Do Jews count as "white" people too?"

nice non-sequitur. saw that one coming a mile away, but that's to be expected what with your amateur, uncreative trolling.
since i'm in a magnanimous mood: jews are a white ethnicity.

"How about Hispanics with mostly european ancestry?"

hispanic is a colloquial term used by american whites to describe latinos of mostly amerindian or mestizo heritage.

"How about Arabs?"

are you feeling left out, yanster? would you like to get into the white club on a technicality? because that's what it sounds like.

"There is so much work that is wasted on things we don't need.Corporations are making things we don't need and at the same time making the people who work for them sick and mentally ill."

I've read The Death of Ivan Ilyich, but I wasn't thinking of it.

What I've said isn't a claim. It's easily seen.

Some small examples:

Law:

The Glass Steagall act was 30 something pages. Dodd-Frank is >2000.

Medicine:

Coronary artery disease, atherosclerosis more generally, type II diabetes, many cancers, mental illness, obesity, asthma, drug addiction and alcoholism, etc. are diseases of civilization.

Financial services:

Liability insurance has a market in part because there are too many law school graduates. Today only about 60 cents of every premium dollar goes to claims.

How much lower would quality of life have been for a free ancient Greek or Roman if he had vaccines, antibiotics, and plumbing? Really.

Etc., etc.


"America 100 years ago was grungy, unequal, and teeming with people speaking languages other than English."

Yes - German, Yiddish, Norwegian, Polish and Italian. Languages aren't really the issue. More Chinese speaking immigrants would be preferable to immigrants from English-speaking Nigeria, Kenya and Jamaica.

You know what gets people to work? Once a society has reached a certain level of economic development (middle income people are guaranteed a secure home, K-12 education, car, warm clothes, etc), it is primarily status anxiety that drives people.

And it isn't just work. The behavioral patterns of SWPLs and the "wrong type of white people" are both driven by status anxiety. SWPLs profess love of diversity because it shows that they are not the type of white people that would compete economically with cheap immigrant labor or have to go live in a ghetto. The "wrong type of white people" are threatened not only economically by the influx of cheap immigrants but suffer status loss as they often must now live and work with them. Elite whites know this and distance themselves from these wrong types of white people. The more intelligent subset of the wrong types of white people get frustrated and come vent on HBD blogs. Don't get me wrong - HBD is real - but as with just about everything we do, there is a status anxiety aspect to it. Both high IQ and low IQ immigrantion introduces some chaos into the American status system.

High IQ people tend to reproduce with high IQ people and beget high IQ children. Even if automation of most simple tasks like strawberry picking were possible, and even if it was possible to provide affordable personal services (such as caretaking of infants and demented elderty) using only white labor (doubtful) - which would make low IQ people less useful - America is not running out of high IQ people to invent and manage things.

As for the question of jews being whites, they are caucasoids, but more accurately a european-middle eastern mix with distinct cultural patterns and tribal mentality. When I think of white people, I think "non-hispanic, non-jewish, whites," or simply WASP.

"You know what gets people to work? Once a society has reached a certain level of economic development (middle income people are guaranteed a secure home, K-12 education, car, warm clothes, etc)..."

Yes, as Ricardo wrote, it depends on the "habits and customs" of the people, too! So you get used to a certain level of luxury and then wages rise about subsistence level...

Jews are, of course, white. Does anyone consider them non-white? Even though I have noted behavioral differences between Jews and (Southern, WASP) gentiles on this blog, the Italians of BENSONHURST, BABY! or the Irish of South Boston would be just as foreign to old money gentry in Virginia.

WASP refers to a very specific type of white people -- Northeastern-ers of Dutch, English, Welsh, Scottish ancestry, almost always with ties to the Episcopal, Presbyterian, or (historical) Congregationalist faiths (or some Calvinist variant), with established roots in America.

Polish pipe-fitters from Chicago, Italian construction workers from Philly, Greek bakers in Providence, Christian Lebanese deli owners from Detroit, Norwegian farmers in Minnesota, Southern Baptists of Ulster stock...all may be thought of as 'white' people, yet none are WASPs.

I still think Jews are different. Genetic evidence shows that Ashkenazim generally have conserved middle eastern paternal lineage but European maternal lineage. In other words, they are descendants of original israelite males who took European wives. A typical ashkenazim man carries the variant of human Y chromosome (passed down patrilinearly) that most Palestinians carry, which is different from what most Europeans carry. If Arabs are not white in popular mind (although they are by Census bureau definitions), it is not completely given that Jews should be considered white. Obama may think of himself as black, but genetically he is black patrilinearly and white european matrilinearly - and this is how I classify Obama in my mind.

"I've read The Death of Ivan Ilyich, but I wasn't thinking of it."

I wasn't thinking of that book. I was thinking of this book by author Ivan Illich

http://www.amazon.com/Tools-Conviviality-Open-Forum-Illich/dp/0714509744

Also, Disabling Professions

http://www.amazon.com/Disabling-Professions-Ideas-Progress-Illich/product-reviews/0714525103/ref=dp_top_cm_cr_acr_txt?ie=UTF8&showViewpoints=1

He has a bunch of other ones too. Toward a History of Needs is a good one.

RandomMedStudent,
Thinking of Jewish genetics in uniparental terms is outdated. The degree of hybridization is much clearer from autosomal studies. Moreover, there is more to the issue than just that Jews are Middle Eastern-European hybrids. The Middle Eastern component in Jewish populations comes from the Levant. Indigenous populations there are among the closest to European populations genetically (closer than southern Arabs). In addition, most Jewish population lack the appreciable sub-Saharan component found in Muslim Middle Eastern groups. Finally, there is a cultural dimension to "whiteness" that goes beyond simple genetics. Lebanese Arabs in the South were considered white. They also happened to be disproportionately Christian. Arab-Americans have become less white in the popular conception as the proportion of Muslims among them has risen. Islam is still more exotic to Christians than Judaism, and it lacks a shared faith text.

"The Middle Eastern component in Jewish populations comes from the Levant."

The Middle Eastern component of Ashkenazi DNA (and many Mizrahi Jews) is Anatolian, not Levantine. It's impossible for Jewish Middle Eastern DNA to be Levnatine when put in context of where Jewish prosyletism and immigration occurred from Alexander the Great's conquests up until the period where the Christian Roman Empire outlawed conversion to Judaism.

"Jews are, of course, white."

Jews are 60-66% Southern European and 25-30% Anatolian, mostly picked up in Asia Minor where the Jews that ultimately became the Southern and Eastern European Jews spent hundreds of years seeking converts, especially along the Ionian Coast of Turkey where Ancient Greece had major colonies going back to the 7th century BC. Not even Jewish Middle Eastern DNA much resembles the original Israelite Jews of Palestine.

"Genetic evidence shows that Ashkenazim generally have conserved middle eastern paternal lineage but European maternal lineage."

Jews genetically cluster closer to Europeans than Armenians do on charts. If you consider Armenians to be white, then Jews are whiter than Armenians.

"Dear TUJ ! This is how Saverin case is related to the general demographic problem."

You missed my point completely. I brought up Saverin only to bring up the issue of immigrants renouncing citizenship, not to compare Saverin's business skills with the average Indio loitering in front of Home Depot.

"How about Hispanics with mostly european ancestry?"

Nobody complains about ethnically European Hispanics. When Americans complain about "Hispanics" they're talking referring to Mestizos and Amerindians and the problems they bring which European Hispanics don't.

"Ashkenazim generally have conserved middle eastern paternal lineage but European maternal lineage. In other words, they are descendants of original israelite males who took European wives. A typical ashkenazim man carries the variant of human Y chromosome (passed down patrilinearly) that most Palestinians carry, which is different from what most Europeans carry. If Arabs are not white in popular mind (although they are by Census bureau definitions),"

Jewish Near Eastern DNA is not Arab and Ashkenazi have very little genetic connection with the original Palestine Jews of Antiquity.

Ashkenazi Jews (and many Mizrahi Jews such as the Georgian and Persian Jews) cluster with Anatolian ethnic groups which cluster around the Caucuses mountains (Anatolian = Persian, Georgian, Armenian, Azeri, Anatolian Turk, Chechens, etc).

Ashkenazi are heavy with J2 and H haplotypes which are commonly found in Anatolian peoples such as Anatolian Turks and Georgians. Levantine Arabs such as Palestinian, Jordanian, Syrian and Lebanese are heavier in J1 haplotypes.

Of course Autosomal studies would be more definitive, however, few studies have bothered to study whether Jewish Middle Eastern DNA is more consistent with Anatolian or Levantine Arab genetic patterns. Until more definitive studies have been conducted, Haplotypes and the history of Jewish migratory and proselytism patterns in the ancient world indicate there is zero logical reason to suspect Jewish Middle Eastern DNA is majority Levantine Arab.

The Jewish groups that most closely resemble the ancient Israelites are the Iraqi and Syrian Jews, not Ashkenazi or the Anatolian bloc Mizrahi Jews.

"Paul Tibbets, his crew, and J Robert Oppenheimer and his crew were the epitome of beta males."

Oppenheimer was a world-class horndog. He nailed a married woman, got her preggo, married her after she got divorced, and all along was nailing yet another woman.

H haplotypes

I meant

G haplotypes

TUJ,
If you are basing your claim that the Middle Eastern component in Jews is Anatolian rather than Levantine on Dienekes'/Dodecad's ADMIXTURE charts, I think you are misinterpreting. The names of components in those charts reflect the populations most enriched in them, but they do not necessarily represent actual source populations. What Dienekes termed the "southwest Asian" component is found at highest percentages in southern Arabs. However, the Southern Arabs themselves possess other components. Indigenous populations of the Levant are not as enriched in the "southwest Asian" component as are the southern Arabs and possess a wider array and more even mixture of components, not entirely dissimilar to the Anatolian mixture of ancestral components although heavier in "southwest Asian." Anyway, remember that Ashkenazi/Sephardi Jewish populations are mixes of European and Middle Eastern so will have intermediate ancestral components by ADMIXTURE as well. In comparison to modern South European populatons, the Jewish populations have elevated "southwest Asian" component. Compared to the indigenous Middle Eastern populations, the "southwest Asian" component appears depleted. This is compatible with admixture. between those two groups or groups with similar ancestry components. I'm not sure that it really allows pinpointing a Levantine source or Anatolian source for the Middle Eastern component. However, historical information would suggest that the Hebrews/Israelites were originally a Levantine population.

"If you are basing your claim that the Middle Eastern component in Jews is Anatolian rather than Levantine on Dienekes'/Dodecad's ADMIXTURE charts, I think you are misinterpreting."

I'm also basing my conclusion about Jewish Middle Eastern DNA on the historical record (the predecessors of Ashkenazi Jews proselytized in Anatolia from Alexander I's conquests up to the late Roman Empire) and the fact Jews have haplotypes such as J2 and G that are more commonly found in Armenian/Cauceses ethnic groups, not Levantine Arabs.

Anatolia and other parts of the Roman Empire also appear to be where Jewish European DNA was picked up because the flow of European DNA into the Southern and Eastern European Jews appears to have ceased at approximately the same time the Christian Roman Empire outlawed conversion to Judaism and any non-Christian faiths.

"Anyway, remember that Ashkenazi/Sephardi Jewish populations are mixes of European and Middle Eastern so will have intermediate ancestral components by ADMIXTURE as well."

I never disputed there was admixture, I disputed the source of the Middle Eastern component of Jewish DNA.

"In comparison to modern South European populatons, the Jewish populations have elevated "southwest Asian" component."

Southern European "Southwest Asian DNA" is irrelevant to a discussion of Anatolian vs Arab genetic characteristics.

The issue is whether Jewish Near Eastern DNA signatures are more consistent with Anatolian/Caucuses peoples or Levantine Arabs. So far, we know Jewish J2 and G haplotypes are consistent with Anatolians, not Levantine Arabs.

"I'm not sure that it really allows pinpointing a Levantine source or Anatolian source for the Middle Eastern component."

It shouldn't be that hard to figure out.

If autosomal studies have determined that Jewish European DNA is overwhelmingly Southern European in origin (and not German or Slavic as previously suspected) then it shouldn't be too hard to analyze the Near Eastern component to determine whether it is Anatolian or Levantine Arab in origin considering the Anatolian and Levantine ethnic groups are about as distinct as Southern and Northern Europeans are to one another.

Haplogroup J2 is more common than J1 among Lebanese, an indigenous Levantine population (or group of populations given the ethno-religious differences there) living close to the original Israeiite homeland.

The autosomal evidence, does not show Ashkenazim to be overwhelmingly southern European. They/we are hybrids between southern Europeans and Middle Easterners (whatever the ultimate Middle Eastern source, Levantine or Anatolian). Atzmon et al 2010 gives a range of 30-60% European admixture for Moroccan, Sephardic and Ashkenazi populations (i.e. does not split them out). Razib at GNXP has found roughly 50% European admixture in the Ashkenazi genotypes he has examined per a comment he made to one of his own threads.

A correction, Atzmon's estimate covered Syrian, Sephardic and Ashkenazi populations. Those were the study groups in which significant admixture was found. Moroccan Jews, being heavily Sephardi influenced, may have European admixture also, but they were not a major subject of the Atzmon study.

" to Mestizos and Amerindians and the problems they bring which European Hispanics don't."

George Zimmerman is a Mestizo. Is he a problem?

"The autosomal evidence, does not show Ashkenazim to be overwhelmingly southern European. They/we are hybrids between southern Europeans and Middle Easterners"

You didn't read what I wrote. I wrote that the European ***Component*** of Ashkenazi DNA is overwhelmingly Southern European, with only a small percentage being Northern European.

"Haplogroup J2 is more common than J1 among Lebanese, an indigenous Levantine population (or group of populations given the ethno-religious differences there) living close to the original Israeiite homeland."

Except the Hellenic Jews who turned into the European Jews weren't located in Lebanon, nor in the Levant. They were located in Anatolia from about 3rd-4th century BC to the late Roman Empire, a good 600-800 years.

If a good chunk of Ashkenazi Jewish European ancestry was picked up from converts along the Ionian coast, why would the Middle Eastern component ALSO have been picked up from Anatolian peoples??

Based on known migratory patterns of Hellenic Jewry, there's no reason to think Ashkenazi Jews have much Levantine DNA or much genetic relationship to the ancient Israelites, unless you think the Hellenic Jews magically picked up little Anatolian DNA while they were in located in Anatolia for 600-800 years during the high tide of Jewish proselytism in the ancient world?

"Moroccan Jews, being heavily Sephardi influenced, may have European admixture also,"

If you refer to Sephardi only as Southern European Jews, the ancestors of Ashkenazi Jews were a small group of Southern European Jews that moved into Eastern Europe. The Ashkenazi should be genetically identical to Southern European Jews except Ashkenazi have a bit higher IQ level and a bit more Northern European DNA than Southern European Jews.

"George Zimmerman is a Mestizo. Is he a problem?"

Mestizos have low IQs and many psychological traits (such as poor future time orientation and propensity to criminality) which renders most of them unassimilable because they will, on average, never identify with Western civilization sufficiently to keep Western civilization nor have the mental characteristics needed to keep America a first world country.

Non-white immigrants should be paid $100,000 per family member to renounce American citizenship and leave for their ancestral lands.

Also Asians should be barred from immigrating regardless of their IQ level on grounds that Europeans, because of cognitive overlap with white Americans, assimilate and identify more smoothly with a Western country because their mental traits overlap and more compatible with Western civilization than Asians.

Asians also drive up the cost of land for white Americans (especially SWPLs) because whites have to constantly move to avoid schools and neighborhoods that have too many Asians in them.

America's immigration policy should be completely racially discriminatory and allow no application to be reviewed unless the applicant is racially white because Western civilazation was built to utilize European cognitive and psychological traits, not Asian psychological traits.

@jay:

"George Zimmerman is a Mestizo. Is he a problem?"

He is Mestizo and, apparently, 1/4 or 1/8 black. He is not a problem.

That is a conclusive prove that Mestizos and Quadroons are not a problem whatsoever.

And you, Jay, really should return to Trade school and get that Plumber license.

Then you will have a steady income despite being stupid and ignorant.

"Asians also drive up the cost of land for white Americans (especially SWPLs) because whites have to constantly move to avoid schools and neighborhoods that have too many Asians in them."

I'm going to go way out on a limb and make a wild guess that the number of whites who've had to move to avoid "too many Asians" in their schools and 'hoods is *maybe* enough to fill a baseball team's roster. Definitely not a football team's roster.

TUJ,

This discussion is getting hopelessly muddled.

My point is that Y-haplogroup J2 is present in indigenous Levantine gruops. One does not have to resort to southern European admixture to explain its presence among Jewish populations. The elevated ratio of J2 to J1, perhaps, but again, the Lebanese are also J2-predominant. They aren't a perfect population genetic proxy for the pre-Hellenistic ancient Jewish population, but there are reasons to expect similarities. Moreover, identity by descent (IBD) analysis in the Atzmon et al paper demonstrates some sharing of small genomic regions with Levantine groups indicative of remote common ancestry. It's quite likely that much of the southern European admixture found in Ashkenazim and Sephardim did enter in Hellenistic Anatolia, but the people who absorbed it were likely of Levantine origin.

"He is not a problem.

That is a conclusive prove that Mestizos and Quadroons are not a problem whatsoever."

You don't think this is a future problem:

http://ca.news.yahoo.com/half-florida-high-school-students-fail-reading-test-232516894.html

"My point is that Y-haplogroup J2 is present in indigenous Levantine gruops. One does not have to resort to southern European admixture to explain its presence among Jewish populations."

???

I said the J2 (and G) Haplotypes indicate an *Anatolian* origin for Ashkenazi Middle Eastern ancestry, not Southern European.

"The elevated ratio of J2 to J1, perhaps, but again, the Lebanese are also J2-predominant."

So are Anatolian Turks.

"Moreover, identity by descent (IBD) analysis in the Atzmon et al paper demonstrates some sharing of small genomic regions with Levantine groups indicative of remote common ancestry."

Since Atzmon didn't distinguish Levantine markers from Anatolian markers, then that still doesn't prove there's much Levantine ancestry in Jews because Anatolian ethnic groups also share some genetic similarities to Levantine groups since both are Near Eastern peoples and have had gene flow between eachother.

But despite common markers between Anatolians and Levantine Arabs, the two can still be distinguished from each other in Ashkenazi DNA analysis just as Southern and Northern European can be distinguished despite the fact both Northern and Southern Europeans share many European markers with eachother.

In fact, didn't earlier DNA analysis underestimate Ashkenazi European origins because Jews were mostly only being compared to Northern Europeans?

The problem is nobody has looked for the origin of Ashkenazi Middle Eastern DNA. Instead everyone has been trying to identify how much European DNA is in Jews while ignoring Middle Eastern ethnicities.

"It's quite likely that much of the southern European admixture found in Ashkenazim and Sephardim did enter in Hellenistic Anatolia,"

1) Then why don't you think Hellenic Jews also picked up DNA from NON-European ethnic groups?

Would you at least say it's likely that Ashkenazi Jewish Middle Eastern DNA is around 50% Anatolian and 50% Levantine Arab (probably more Syrian than Palestinian)?

2) If Syrian Jews are 30% European, then that strongly indicates there was gene flow from Anatolian Jews (who had already picked up quite a bit of European DNA from Greeks and Romans) and more Levantine Syrian Jews.

Look, nebbish, do you think the following DNA breakdown of Ashkenazi Jews is plausible within 5 or so percentage points:

~50% Southern European (probably Greek and Italian)

~10% Northern European (probably Slavic, and, to lesser extent, German)

~25% Anatolian (specifically Anatolian Turk and Armenian, and maybe some Kurdish)

~15% Levantine Arab (probably Syrian)

Does this sound plausible given known migratory patterns and current DNA results?

@The Undiscovered Jew:


""He is not a problem.

That is a conclusive prove that Mestizos and Quadroons are not a problem whatsoever."

You don't think this is a future problem:

http://ca.news.yahoo.com/half-florida-high-school-students-fail-reading-test-232516894.html"


Do I have to put a smiley face to indicate an attempt on irony?

What I wrote was a response to an ignoramus who submitted Zimm example (a one data point) as an answer to potential problems of Mestizo population (statistical data).

Ironically, someone in this thread quoted John Derbyshire talking about ignorant fools who cannot differentiate between a single data point and statistics.

"I'm going to go way out on a limb and make a wild guess that the number of whites who've had to move to avoid "too many Asians" in their schools"

You were saying?

White Flight in Silicon Valley As Asian Students Move In

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB113236377590902105.html

http://www.contracostatimes.com/ci_9113014

"Do I have to put a smiley face to indicate an attempt on irony?"

Nevermind then.

Peter, no more Asian immigrants. The official HBD position on immigration and emigration must be 100% white immigration and large cash payouts to any non-white immigrant who wants to "Go Saverin" and hand in his citizenship.

White Bay Area high schoolers wouldn't be fleeing their schools if European immigrants were heading to their neighborhoods.

A small number of assimilited Asian Americans is not a problem, but white Americans don't have enough psychological overlap with even the most Americanized Asian Americans to be able to stand living in neighborhoods, workplaces, and schools that are going to be overwhelmingly Asian if non-white immigration isn't stopped and reversed.

I also intend to have children (at some point) and when I intend to not have to pay billions of dollars worth of Facebook IPOs a year in tuition to have the privilege of sending them to the last remaining high school in America that isn't at least 75% Asian.

If "Operation Saverin" becomes official policy, then many high quality public schools (which I wouldn't have to pay for) may actually become usable for white Americans again.

Btw, how racially diverse is *your* neighborhood?

I assume Peter's neighborhood is somewhere around 40% Asian, 30% black, 25% non-white Hispanic and 5% white, yes?

"I assume Peter's neighborhood is somewhere around 40% Asian, 30% black, 25% non-white Hispanic and 5% white, yes?"

Ha ha. For the town as a whole, 2010 census figures say 81.2% white, 10.8% black and 18.8% Hispanic. Obviously there's some white/Hispanic overlap. If you don't count Hispanics the town's about 70% white. My particular 'hood is maybe somewhat less white than the town as a whole, I'd guess on the order of 65%, with most of the minorities being Hispanic.

http://www.zip-codes.com/zip-code/11763/zip-code-11763-2010-census.asp

"For the town as a whole, 2010 census figures say 81.2% white, 10.8% black and 18.8% Hispanic."

If it became 81.2% Asian would you stay in it or leave it?

"I also intend to have children (at some point) and when I intend to not have to pay billions of dollars worth of Facebook IPOs a year in tuition to have the privilege of sending them to the last remaining high school in America that isn't at least 75% Asian."

If you have a nerdy son, living in an area with a lot of Asians might be your best chance at having grandchildren.

"living in an area with a lot of Asians might be your best chance at having grandchildren."

Not interested in having grandchildren with Asian mental and physical characteristics (if my kids want to remain in my will) and white nerds do get white women, especially if they're funny.

So, if you're neighborhood becomes 81% Asian, I assume you will stay for the sake of your grandkids, yes?

TUJ wrote:
"The official HBD position on immigration and emigration must be 100% white immigration and large cash payouts to any non-white immigrant who wants to "Go Saverin" and hand in his citizenship."

Since when did HBD have an official position on immigration? I have never heard of this idea of offering 100K PER family member to leave from anyone other than TUJ. Asians are currently 5% of total US population and 4% of births. It is exceptionally unlikely that you will billions of dollars for "last remaining high school in America that isn't at least 75% Asian."

If I have children, I'd like to live in a neighborhood with sufficiently high real estate prices to keep dysfunctional people out. As for the Asian percentage, 81% is undesirable because it is way too unusual, but so is a neighborhood that is 98% non-hispanic White. Neighborhoods with highly atypical concentration of single race/ethnicity (the atypical threshold is lower for Asians since they are a small minority overall) suggest something unusual about the preferences of the people living there and for that reason should be avoided.

"Since when did HBD have an official position on immigration? I have never heard of this idea of offering 100K PER family member to leave from anyone other than TUJ."

Excuse me for not checking in with you before giving my opinion, your majesty.

"Asians are currently 5% of total US population"

They're filling up private schools and good public schools much more rapidly than their percentage indicates because they're concentrated in areas that have sizable upper middle and upper class whites - which is why, as Lena Dunham has illustrated, many SWPLs express an overt level of ethnic disdain against Asians that they would never express against lower IQ racial minorities who have actually been quite successfully segregated from the white population.

Asians, however, are too smart and wealthy to be kept out of SWPL neighborhoods, hip colleges, and top high schools and they are driving up the cost of living in top areas.

"It is exceptionally unlikely that you will billions of dollars for "last remaining high school in America that isn't at least 75% Asian."

Where are upper class white people supposed to send students to school?

If upscale whites in even Cupertino can't use the high schools, Calstate colleges, and neighborhoods, where are they supposed to live and send their children to? Inner city Newark?

"If I have children, I'd like to live in a neighborhood with sufficiently high real estate prices to keep dysfunctional people out."

Why shouldn't white Americans pay high real estate prices when they can just pay the dysfunctional people (who are increasingly low intelligence and unassimilable immigrants) to leave the country Saverin style so there would be more nice neighborhoods with less high real estate prices in the best areas?

"As for the Asian percentage, 81% is undesirable because it is way too unusual,"

The only way to keep from hitting that "unusual" 81% mark is to racially discriminate in favor of white immigrants.

"but so is a neighborhood that is 98% non-hispanic White."

It no more unreasonable for upper middle class white Americans to live in a 98% white neighborhood than it is unreasonable for Chinese, Japanese, and South Koreans to live in 98% Chinese, 98% Japanese and 98% South Korean neighborhoods in China, Japan, and South Korea, respectively.

This is because Chinese, Japanese, and South Korean civilizations depend on East Asian mental characteristics to maintain their civilization. Likewise, the United States is a white nation built around white mental capacities, and, like the listed East Asian nations above, white Americans have a right to set the demographics of their country in a way that will maintain white demographics.

"Neighborhoods with highly atypical concentration of single race/ethnicity (the atypical threshold is lower for Asians since they are a small minority overall) suggest something unusual about the preferences of the people living there and for that reason should be avoided."

Does this mean Chinese, Japanese, and South Koreans should avoid living in 98% ethnically Chinese, Japanese and South Korean neighborhoods in their own country.

***Mestizos have low IQs and many psychological traits (such as poor future time orientation and propensity to criminality) which renders most of them unassimilable because they will, on average, never identify with Western civilization sufficiently to keep Western civilization nor have the mental characteristics needed to keep America a first world country.***

Amazingly, a Japanese economist was able to basically make some of these points in the Chicago Tribune 20 years ago.

"Nonetheless, it is only a matter of time before U.S. minority groups espouse self-determination in some form. When that happens, the country may become ungovernable.

Today, non-white groups are challenging the traditional order. Within the next 100 years, and probably much sooner, most Americans will be people of color. For the first time since the United States came into being, Caucasians will be a minority. Illiteracy may become widespread, and many Americans will not speak standard English.

Japan, too, faces major changes. A graying economic superpower, it may be a society of old people by the early 21st Century. Because of our low birth rate, we might have to admit more foreign workers, skilled and unskilled, to provide basic services and keep the factories running. But these problems pale in comparison with the upheaval threatened by America`s demographic evolution. Do blacks and Hispanics, for instance, have the skills and knowledge to run an advanced industrial economy? If the answer is yes, America will maintain its vitality through the next century and beyond. But I`m skeptical. Consider black Africa, for example. Struggling against outside pressures to forge independent nation-states from different tribal cultures, the region is plagued by poverty, political instability and other serious problems. Former Spanish and Portuguese colonies in Latin America have also failed to create viable high-tech societies. Iberian and African cultural traits seem to impede industrialization....

The concept of contractual obligation is also vital. No modern society can operate efficiently without a willingness on the part of its citizens to observe formal agreements. Economists warn that the newly industrialized economies will have difficulty developing further in an interdependent world without cultivating this value. In many Arab countries, people don`t even keep appointments. With such attitudes, how can they catch up with the industrialized world?...

Equally important, to compete in a high-tech age dominated by microelectronics requires a disciplined, well-trained labor force. This is true for the United States as well as other countries. Brilliant inventors and innovative engineers are not enough. Workers themselves must be highly motivated and equipped to meet the stringent norms of standardization imposed by precision-perfect high-tech manufacturing.

Blue-collar employees have to work steadily, day in and day out, at jobs requiring great concentration and manual dexterity. They must continually hone skills and improve personal performance and products through quality control. A moment`s carelessness-a measurement error of one-tenth of a millimeter, for example-can ruin an entire product line and put a company out of business.

Unfortunately, relatively few national groups meet these exacting requirements. I doubt that many African or Latin American countries, for instance, will become high-tech societies in the foreseeable future."

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/1991-04-16/news/9102030765_1_ethnic-industrial-blacks-and-hispanics

Some people here sound like a angry black males complaining about the whiteys... just saying.

taken from the blog's comment policy.

"Paleo-conservative whites complaining about the Jews keeping them down are similar to blacks complaining about the whites keeping them down."

***Some people here sound like a angry black males complaining about the whiteys...***

Human nature to resist displacement? You see comments on Asias Finest as well complaining about white males and asian women. Not sure that will ever change.

The Undiscovered Jew,

Germany's immigration problem is due to Turks (i.e. Anatolians). If these Turks were non-religious or were Christians or something, do you think the Germans shouldn't be allowed to be against Turkish immigration since Turks are Anatolian?

"white nerds do get white women, especially if they're funny."

Funny nerds tend to get friendzoned a lot as well.

"The official HBD position on immigration and emigration must be 100% white immigration and large cash payouts to any non-white immigrant who wants to "Go Saverin" and hand in his citizenship."

How do you promote this position without letting the cat of free association out of the bag? Once you put this position out there and in people's heads and people start thinking about free association and about being able to put restrictions, anti-Semites and religious nuts and others are going to try to take advantage and try to gain the right to have restrictions in their states, cities, local areas, etc. against people they don't like.

This is one of the worst things to happen to america

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